Fall of Ravnica

Hello, everyone. Ever since I started collecting Magic cards, I have been interested in the plane of Ravnica. This could be passed of as some sort of obsession due to when I started collecting, but that is beside the point. I have started building a set with a new mechanic for each guild, but many of them still need to be fixed. I will have a list of the mechanics at the end of this post. For any mechanic that isn't filled, you may create your own.
I have associated each of ten planeswalkers to a different guild, and part of this contest is creating a planeswalker to fit their role in the guild. I would also like each participant to create two creatures in that guild, one using the guild's mechanic while another combos with it. If this sounds like an interesting idea, feel free to enter.

Guild Mechanics
Azorius: Convict--Whenever this creature blocks, resolve an effect (i.e. getting +0/+3 until end of turn, tapping a creature, preventing a creature from untapping, etc.)

Izzet: Malfunction--When you cast this spell, if you have already cast an instant or sorcery spell this turn, you may pay (price). If you do, (effect.)

Rakdos: Depravity X--Whenever this creature deals damage to an opponent, each opponent loses X life.

Golgari: Decompose X--When this creature dies, return it to the battlefield with X additional -1/-1 counters

Selesnya: Lifebond--When this creature enters the battlefield, resolve an effect for each creature you control with lifebond (i.e. gaining life, drawing a card, etc.)

Boros: Assault X--At the beginning of combat on your turn, if the total power among creatures you control is greater than or equal to X, resolve an effect (i.e. Dealing 1 damage, creating a 1/1 white soldier with first strike, etc.)

Gruul: Relentless--You may sacrifice this creature as it attacks. If you do, resolve an effect.

Simic: Mutate--At the beginning of your upkeep you may pay 2UG. If you do, sacrifice this creature, then put a +1/+1 counter on each creature you control.

Dimir: Dementia--Prevent all damage this creature would deal to players. Players put the top card of their library into their graveyard for each damage prevented.

Orzhov: Ethereal--When this creature enters or leaves the battlefield, create a 1/2 white spirit creature token with lifelink or a 2/1 black spirit creature token with flying.

Planeswalker Guilds:
Gideon--Azorius
Jace--Izzet
Lliana--Rakdos
Garruk--Golgari
Elspeth--Selesnya
Ajani--Boros
Domri--Gruul
Nissa--Simic
Tezzeret--Dimir
Sorin--Orzhov
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Comments

  • Hello @NokiSkaur,

    Sounds like a cool set! I do have a couple of questions to help define the set more. Please take no offense if the questions sound condescending.

    • Is that many planeswalkers really necessary? To me, it sounds very odd that all of these planeswalkers are on the same plane and all are involved with each other. In addition, I would suggest re-coordinating the planeswalkers with their respective guild. For example, Chandra wants absolutely nothing to do with militaristic dictatorships that make up the Boros Legion. Sarkhan, if anything, would gravitate towards the Izzet League because DRAGOOOONNNNNSSSSSSSS! And remember that Kiora wants absolutely nothing to do with anything besides Zendikar, so it would be extremely unlikely that she would involve herself with the Simic Combine.

    • Are all the guilds going to be present in the same set, like Dragons Maze? If so, how would you represent the guilds equally?

    • Have the guilds changed since RTR? Have their motives changed? For example, the Izzet League's primary color changed from red to blue, symbolizing their change from randomness to more focused research.

    • How will Ravnica fall? Will the guilds disband and all the guildmasters die? If you have some time and brainspace left, I would recommend reading this article about hypothesizing the fall of the guilds:

    http://www.gatheringmagic.com/samkeeper-06082017-sympathy-for-the-deep-kraul/


    In addition, you can peruse my own past Ravnica set for ideas. It is a bit outdated, and some of the abilities may require adjustment. But feel free to loot it for inspiration!

    https://mtgcardsmith.com/user/Ravnica_United/cards
  • @Gelectrode
    These aren't final for the set--these are just to see what ideas people would have. I haven't been able to find the lore for either Ravnica arc, so I thought that the Boros fought less for control and more for justice. That was a mistake on my part.

    If I were to make a full block/set out of this, it would probably only have three or four total planeswalkers, but I wanted more for the sake of the contest.

    I made the name before the concept, but part of the reason for Ravnica's fall is the Dimir. The Dimir have started controlling the Azorius, giving them control over both the Boros in turn. They started influencing the Rakdos and used the threat of an attack by them to further control the Azorius. The Azorius started putting laws in place to limit the power of each other guild which, in the end, resulted in both the Izzet and Simic being practically useless. The only guilds that haven't been affected are the Gruul, the Orzhov, and the Selesnya, but it's only a matter of time before the Dimir spread over them too.
  • My little advice would be: never forget Ravnican sets have TEN mechanics which is an insanely high number of mechanics. This means your number one concern should always be complexity and how to keep it at a minimum. Some of the guilds have been, a posteriori, considered huge mechanical fails by R&D because of this (Dimir is the obvious example).

    On the mechanics you already designed:

    - Imprison: That's probably way too complex and wordy, and it's more due to flavour than great gameplay.
    - Lifebond: Awesome! ^^
    - Assault: It's good but "during your combat phase" is not an appropriate trigger, you would rather use "at the beginning of combat on your turn". Also, managing to keep the same X on every card would strongly help keep the complexity in check.
    - Mutate: Also quite good (though I'm not sure the sacrifice aspect fits the Simic flavour) but creatures don't "get" +1/+1 counters, you "put a +1/+1 counter" on them. Pumping your whole team is probably too strong though.
  • @ningyounk
    I'm not quite sure how to simplify Imprison while keeping it's normal effect. Should I just give it an upkeep cost and exile without creating the token?

    I want to keep the X different for Assault to keep it from being too similar to Formidable. I also believe that it leaves more design space for the mechanic. If you have Assault 30 to win the game, would assault 30 be reasonable for creating two 1/1 white soldiers with first strike? Would Assault four be reasonable to win the game?

    As for Mutate, I needed to have the sacrifice for balancing reasons. If you sac the creature, there's more cost to pumping the entire team. I understand how it wouldn't make much sense outside of the mechanic, but I needed there to be a risk/reward setup. I wasn't thinking straight when I made the list, so that's the biggest reason why the wording for both Mutate and Assault was off.

    Originally, I had all ten mechanics created, but six of them needed massive fixes. Golgari, Orzhov, Dimir, and Gruul were way too broken while Izzet and Rakdos were underpowered. If you have any suggestions for mechanics, I could add them in the challenge afterwards.
  • @NokiSkaur Don't hesitate to try a looot of different mechanics in each slot ^^ There's no need to clutch on a mechanic too hard if it's problematic, for instance I'm not sure I would be able to make Imprison work better while keeping its concept because it has a tax component, a token creation component and a detain component which will always give you wordy mechanics whatever you try to decline it. So maybe it would be interesting to try a totally different concept.
  • @ningyounk
    I'm not sure if the new Azorius mechanic is "fixed" perse, but it's different now. I've also added Perpetuate, the Orzhov's new mechanic. I used toughness instead of mana cost in the new Perpetuate, so balancing isn't simultaneously buffing.
  • edited June 2017
    This is just a suggestion, but gruul could have "{Ability name}- When this creature attacks, you may {effect}. If you do, sacrifice this creature."

    It would relate to the gruuls recklessness, in being sacrificed, but they would be somewhat more powerful before they leave, mostly keyword abilities, Power/Toughness buffs and even adding mana to the mana pool.

    What do you guys think?
  • @Karmadragon, if a creature is sacrificed while attacking, it would deal no damage.
  • @Gelectrode
    At the end of the turn then?
  • @Karmadragon
    I had a similar ability called Ransack for the Gruul. It would work similar to
    "Ransack 4: You may have this creature enter the battlefield tapped and attacking. If you do, destroy up to four lands and/or artifacts defending player controls. Sacrifice this creature at the beginning of combat on your turn."
  • @NokiSkaur
    Oh, neat! Is that the ability being used for the Gruul?
  • edited June 2017
    @Karmadragon
    "I had a similar ability called Ransack for the Gruul."
    I think I designed it for the Dimir...
  • edited June 2017
    @Karmadragon
    I could add that version. I might change my mind if I think of something better. The problem with it is design space. If they have any artifacts, they'll destroy those. After that, they're just destroying lands. After a while, it might stack up, but I don't think it's that good.
  • @NokiSkaur, I would highly recommend staying away from keyworded land destruction. Destroying 4 of someone's lands is not just overpowered, but seriously unfun. Keep away from such hazardous territory.
  • @Gelectrode
    That's another big problem I had with Ransack. Basically all of the ones I didn't list before were overpowered except for Izzet and Rakdos. "Balancing" would buff the Orzhov, the Golgari would almost always wipe the board when a creature of theirs died, the Dimir gained control of creatures, and the Gruul got to destroy anything they wanted. Everything needed MASSIVE reworks in order to be playable.
  • @Corwinnn
    Do you have any ideas on what I should add, remove, or change?
  • @NokiSkaur - I think @Gelectrode and @ningyounk have covered most of what I would suggest aside from playtesting, which is just alluded to. The best way to see how well something works is to give it some life and see how much you love or hate it.
  • Ransack would be hellish to word properly, since creatures do not enter "tapped and attacking" in main phase, so they would probably need some kind of semi-flash that allows you to cast them during declare attackers step, but then they still would need slme ability to limit their casting, since right now, ransack doesn't say anything about the phases which is kinda problematic
  • Also don't forget the mechanics must not only work by themselves in a vacuum, they must interact a little with the nine other mechanics in the environment ;)

    For @Karmadragon's suggestion, it's funny because it's the original idea behind Exert on Amonkhet! ^^ Then they softened a little the idea and just freezed the creature instead of sacrificing it. It sounds like an excellent mechanic for Rakdos more than Gruul, because Gruul players like to keep their creatures andmake them grow ;)

    The article talking about the making of Exert: http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/making-magic/amonkhet-down-business-part-3-2017-04-17

    This is the example they give in the article:

    Reckless Giant
    3R
    Creature—Giant
    3/3
    Reckless—Gain +3/+3 and trample until end of turn.
    (If you use a reckless ability, sacrifice the creature at the end of the turn.)
  • @Glasseschan
    Yet another reason why I'm not implementing Ransack. It was just an idea that I threw out there before realising how broken it was. Destroying creatures and planeswalker doesn't sound like the Gruul, they probably can't destroy enchantments, instants and sorceries go straight into the graveyard, and that leaves lands and artifacts. Destroying artifacts is situational, destroying lands is broken, so I won't implement Ransack as a mechanic.
  • @ningyounk
    Now that you say it, the ability I thought of did come from that article. And it does sound much more like a rakdos mechanic. :)
  • For the Rakdos, I've been contemplating a mechanic called Revel. I think the phrasing would be similar to, "When this creature deals combat damage to an opponent, it gets +2/+0 and gains trample until the end of your next turn." Would that be a decent mechanic or is it too powerful?
  • @NokiSkaur Well it wouldn't do much unless it can attack again in the same turn because it would get +2/+0 and trample AFTER dealing damage, so when combat is already over. The closest functional mechanic that I can think of is Frenzy from Future Sight: http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=126187

    What's your policy on re-using already existing mechanics?
  • edited June 2017
    @NokiSkaur
    A suggestion for the House Dimir:

    Marked -- Whenever you are dealt damage by a [creature or planeswalker], put a target counter on it. [Creature or planeswalker] with a target counter on it [effect].

    The good thing is that multiple marked effect is also stackable (obviously). It also seems fitting for any assassin-subtype creature. Or just creature-killing artifacts in general.

    Does it feels decent or not?
  • @ningyounk
    "Until the end of your next turn"
    I would rather not use a preexisting mechanic, but I will if I have to.

    @sanjaya666
    This sounds interesting, but I'm trying to have Dimir be more blue, and it wouldn't leave much design space around manipulation. I'll still keep it in mind--I might think of an interesting way to implement it.

  • Just for clarity, these are the colour focuses of the guilds.

    Azorius--Blue
    Izzet--Red
    Rakdos--Red
    Golgari--Black
    Selesnya--White
    Boros--Red
    Gruul--Green
    Simic--Green
    Dimir--Blue
    Orzhov--White
  • Also, if I may add this, could the guildless get more representation?
  • @Karmadragon
    Yes, that's what I was planning on. The guildless will have their own mechanic, but I'll work that out once everything else is finished. A big part of the story will be Tezzeret supplying the guildless with weapons in order to overthrow the guilds, start a new war, and contribute to the fall of Ravnica.
  • @NokiSkaur

    Beware on the guildless, giving them an identity brings two issues you need to be careful about:
    - The guildless are mentioned in the story to justify all the cards that don't belong to any guild. If they have a mechanical identity, they can't fill this role anymore.
    - You're basically creating an 11th guild, Ravnica is already very crowded mechanically so you should be extra careful with complexity creep.

    Here are blog posts from Mark Rosewater (head designer for Magic) about the guildless that may interest you:
    - http://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/78577253481/when-we-go-back-to-ravnica-id-like-too-see-the
    - http://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/78578709026/the-problem-with-the-guildless-is-that-ravnica-is

    __________

    On the colour focuses of the guilds, it goes a bit against the philosophy of Ravnica design to insist more on one colour or the other, because R&D is trying really hard to make them feel like something unique coming from the association of the two colours. That said, if you really want to make them feel more monocoloured, I strongly suggest that every colour appears once as the main colour of a guild in both ally and enemy colours cycle. If not, the gameplay will feel shifted towards some colours.

    Right now, you have:

    ALLY COLOURS:
    - WU Azorius — Blue
    - UB Dimir — Blue
    - BR Rakdos — Red
    - RG Gruul — Green
    - GW Selesnya — White
    ==> Dimir needs to be black-focused to balance gameplay or it's going to feel super controlly.

    ENEMY COLOURS:
    - WB Orzhov — White
    - UR Izzet — Red
    - BG Golgari — Black
    - RW Boros — Red
    - GU Simic — Green
    ==> Izzet needs to be blue-focused or gameplay is going to feel too agressive.
  • @ningyounk
    Those colour choices are based on the bigger focus of the guild, whether it be in story or mechanic. The Dimir needs to be slightly more blue than black so that their control of the Azorius makes more sense. The Izzet need to be slightly more red to symbolize their pushback against the Azorius' control of their experiments.

    I do agree that an eleventh mechanic would be excessive, but I want to separate the guildless somehow. Maybe I could add more equipment/artifacts in order to symbolize Tezzeret's supply of the guildless? I'm not quite sure...
This discussion has been closed.