@Ranshi922 I can understand why you have a misunderstanding. I agree with @Lujikul that we shouldn't start a religious debate here, so I'm just going to respond to your confusion and then drop it.
1. The Bible isn't fiction. People refute it out of selfishness and use misunderstood arguments to "debate their way" out of heeding it.
2. Lust is a sin, and also part of human nature after the first sin (just as every sinful action is). If we weren't inclined to sin, nobody would. However, lust and reproduction aren't at all linked. We were created with affection for opposite genders, and God created the first woman so that he could show us what love for each other was and the benefit two individuals being joined together would have on each. This isn't lust, this is love. It is the desire to care for, live with, and procreate with one of opposite gender as God intended, under the sacred covenant of marriage. Were this globally understood, there wouldn't be single parents (unless one died), orphans (unless both parents died), or nearly as widespread levels of unhappiness in "love." God also forbids divorce outside of very specific scenarios because love (not lust) and marriage is so important.
Anyway, food for thought. @Corwinnn is very adept at bringing these conversations to a close if need be, but we've each made our statement and I for one will drop it in this discussion. If anyone would like to discuss biblical topics with me, feel free to do so via PM.
@TenebrisNemo The other aspect is that the skull is simply inconsistent with the rest of the designs. The other 4 are things you see in nature, which can be good or bad depending on how it effects you at the time. A skull isn't a natural thing/regular occurrance you just happen to see out for a walk or a hike...it means a person died and majority of us has nothing good to associate with that or normally see. It's a literal construct of man. I really wish they'd gone and used the crescent moon similiar to what we see on flip cards back sides.
You don't exactly see fire while out on a walk or hike, either, though. Fire is closer to being a construct of man than the skull is, seeing as how fire occurs naturally much less often. The skull resides in all living vertebrates, and is often used as the ultimate sign of finality and death. Just like anything else, there's nothing inherently good or bad about it, it simply just is. It's all in how you apply it.
Speaking of Liliana acting for selfish reasons and not caring for consequences makes me immediately think of Loki, ppl think of as the evil one as well. Especially compared to Thor. But well, he's "just" the god of mischief. His morals differ from the views, humans have, but that doesn't make him evil as well. He's definitely not the good guy, like Liliana isn't a paladin of light. But the bad guys are others.
@Mila You're hitting on the reason a discussion like this could exist at all: we're discussion fictional characters with supernatural abilities set in fictional scenarios. These are the elements that blur the lines for the readers/watchers, and intentionally so. The writers know what they are doing when attempting to make the audience uncertain of a characters overall role in simple black or white. They also intentionally introduce such "trouble-maker" characters alongside ones characterized as The Villain(s) so as to add elements of intrigue.
I've done a fair bit of reading and writing (and even movie watching, though most "modern films" I either don't enjoy or don't watch and "superhero" movies are among those) and tend to pick up on author's intentions even when I'd prefer to be held in suspense.
Of course, Loki and Liliana are designed this way for a reason, but the writers' intentions don't play a role for the question, if Liliana did something wrong or not. That point even proofs in a way, that Liliana isn't the bad guy...
I like the skull as black mana’s symbol. Death is a natural part of life. Contemplating our mortality teaches us to cherish the life we have, because it’s the only one we’re gunna get. And skulls look badass.
Religious tenets aren’t the best tool for gauging morality any longer, but there’s value in studying it to understand our history and gain perspective on how far we’ve come and how far we need to go. So I definitely wouldn’t judge Lilianna’s overall goodness or badness based on something like that. Her actions speak for her enough. She’s ambitious and self serving but has done great things for those around her before too. She’s just complex and mostly grey, to me.
The whole thing with sefishness and evil is that there is nothing that would guarantee that she would be any different than Bolas if she was given the power. To me she is a bit like Little Finger which is pretty much the model of a Neutral Evil character.
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I can understand why you have a misunderstanding. I agree with @Lujikul that we shouldn't start a religious debate here, so I'm just going to respond to your confusion and then drop it.
1. The Bible isn't fiction. People refute it out of selfishness and use misunderstood arguments to "debate their way" out of heeding it.
2. Lust is a sin, and also part of human nature after the first sin (just as every sinful action is). If we weren't inclined to sin, nobody would. However, lust and reproduction aren't at all linked. We were created with affection for opposite genders, and God created the first woman so that he could show us what love for each other was and the benefit two individuals being joined together would have on each. This isn't lust, this is love. It is the desire to care for, live with, and procreate with one of opposite gender as God intended, under the sacred covenant of marriage. Were this globally understood, there wouldn't be single parents (unless one died), orphans (unless both parents died), or nearly as widespread levels of unhappiness in "love." God also forbids divorce outside of very specific scenarios because love (not lust) and marriage is so important.
Anyway, food for thought. @Corwinnn is very adept at bringing these conversations to a close if need be, but we've each made our statement and I for one will drop it in this discussion. If anyone would like to discuss biblical topics with me, feel free to do so via PM.
You're hitting on the reason a discussion like this could exist at all: we're discussion fictional characters with supernatural abilities set in fictional scenarios. These are the elements that blur the lines for the readers/watchers, and intentionally so. The writers know what they are doing when attempting to make the audience uncertain of a characters overall role in simple black or white. They also intentionally introduce such "trouble-maker" characters alongside ones characterized as The Villain(s) so as to add elements of intrigue.
I've done a fair bit of reading and writing (and even movie watching, though most "modern films" I either don't enjoy or don't watch and "superhero" movies are among those) and tend to pick up on author's intentions even when I'd prefer to be held in suspense.
Everyone makes mistakes, myself included; still do. It's important to recognize things for what they are.
Like I said, feel free to PM if you like to learn more. I've helped multiple people through this kind of thing.
A. It got wayyyyyyy too out of hand
B. We aren't even talking mostly about Liliana anymore
C. Religion?!
@Corwinnn please close this up
Religious tenets aren’t the best tool for gauging morality any longer, but there’s value in studying it to understand our history and gain perspective on how far we’ve come and how far we need to go. So I definitely wouldn’t judge Lilianna’s overall goodness or badness based on something like that. Her actions speak for her enough. She’s ambitious and self serving but has done great things for those around her before too. She’s just complex and mostly grey, to me.
To me she is a bit like Little Finger which is pretty much the model of a Neutral Evil character.