@Alextorrez6 I like this! I see what you mean when you say it would balance well with the other mechanics in the set, as most sets don't introduce more than one or two new mechanics anyway. While the name encore might fit the theme a little better in general, I see that this would be a great world to bring Rebound back in. Besides, Harmonize and Compose are both music themed in any case, so we don't really need another heavily music-based mechanic.
In conclusion, we'll be changing it to Rebound!
At this point, I want to shift our discussion back to Harmonize. While the name does great with the set's theme, the ability itself is pretty ridiculous. Right now, every time you harmonize, you add a ton of power to the board, and all the tokens support each other. If you harmonized 5 times in a game, you will have 25 power/toughness! I came up with this mechanic, so I am certainly to blame, but I think we need to go back to the drawing board for this before we start on the set skeleton.
OK, so I've been thinking about this, and I settled on something interesting:
Harmonize: Put three +1/+1 counters on target noncreature permanent you control. It becomes a 0/0 Song creature in addition to its other types.
Here's an example:
I actually really like this new version, and it seems much more balanced and less broken. This is kind of like what the newest Nissa does, and I really like the theme of "Harmonize" bringing the plane itself to life. This would also allow us to still use the Song creature type, which I think is pretty cool. I would be happy for any feedback on this new idea!
@shadow123 thanks for this! About Harmonize N, I do like the concept, let's see how it looks here...
The text "Harmonize 3" looks a little awkward, but I think it could work! As you said, it would definitely open up more possibilities for design. I say we should use it.
At first I thought this was basically just amass, but it's actually quite different. Unlike amass, it can't keep adding to the same permanent, because once it becomes a creature, the ability cannot target it anymore. This is a good thing in my opinion, because it prevents "voltron"-style strategies with the song tokens.
Another thing I like about this is that it forces you to use an existing permanent, rather than creating one from scratch. As you mentioned, this makes a lot of sense thematically, since it simulates bringing the plane to life through music.
It also forces players to be strategic, because, yes, you could animate your lands, but at the same time, players will now be able to remove your lands much more easily (because they are creatures). Additionally, people will also be able to animate things like enchantments, artifacts, sagas, and even auras (which may or may not be a ruling nightmare... I don't know, can auras attack on their own if they're creatures?). Regardless, it will be a lot of fun. You could even do stuff like static artifacts that say "if this artifact is a creature (or "if this artifact is a Song creature"), it gets +1/+0" or stuff like that.
Overall, lots of design space, especially with Harmonize N as Shadow mentioned.
We have finally finished settling on the new and old mechanics for this set, and I can't thanks you guys enough for all the support and ideas within the past few weeks! I'm excited to get things rolling with the large scale design and common skeleton. The next step would be to determine how many of each mechanic we want to have in each color within the common skeleton. We must remember that the two mechanics Harmonize and Rebound belong to the two main factions of the plane. The outcasts are Selesnya (G/W), and use Harmonize, while the music school is Grixis (U/B/R), and utilizes the mechanic Rebound from older mtg sets. The other two mechanics, Inspired and Enlighten, are utilized by creatures and spells respectively, however they make use of the entire color pie.
That said, here is my first attempt at a basic distribution:
When it comes to the fifth and final mechanic, Compose, this is the one that I was struggling with the most. It isn't symmetrical with any of the other four mechanics, however because it is our scry replacement, it should be in fairly high numbers:
Compose: 3 Blue, 3 Green, 1 Colorless
Another option would be to just cut compose all together, replace it with scry, and distribute more Blue and Green within the main four mechanics. What do you guys think of this idea?
I'd be happy for any feedback anyone has to offer!
You can see that, in taking out compose, I have added three more of the Blue and Green colors to the original four mechanics. Do you guys think this would work?
@Arceus8523 I figured, and there are going to be a lot of cards like that in the set, especially with rebound, so it's good to hear that we're not breaking the rules of magic too much with the commons (:
@Alextorrez6 yes! I'm thrilled for this. We can probably stay in "Exploratory design" for a while, so we don't fill up the forums, but I'm really excited to begin the real thing.
I've been working for the past few days on a spreadsheet for the common skeleton. You can find it here to track our official progress:
NOTE: -The boxes in the skeleton with just numbers refer to creature cards with that mana cost. -Everything below the 19 cards of each color are just mechanics and keywords we will need to include. -I have set aside some space for each of the central mechanics next to the skeleton so we can track our progress as we go. -This uses the skeleton, more or less, for Amonkhet, if anyone was wondering. I also constructed it around the commons skeletons of recent sets Theros Beyond Death and Ikoria for better balance.
I'll be using mtg set editor to make the final cards, but until then, anything is welcome! If anyone wants to start coming up with ideas for the commons, please do so, and I'll do the same. Let's do this!
Correct @Alextorrez6. It's probably going to be meant for draft and some standard gameplay, and I made the skeleton around recent standard sets for this reason.
Something to keep in mind as you're creating cards (just as a proactive reminder)... you have one ability that's only for creatures (inspired), two that only work on spells (enlightened and rebound), and one that works on both (Harmonize)... so to keep things balanced, just remember to make Harmonize equally proportional to Inspired for the creatures, but for the spells, it will be a smaller proportion because it will be split among three abilities instead of just two. Again, just a proactive reminder.
Comments
In conclusion, we'll be changing it to Rebound!
At this point, I want to shift our discussion back to Harmonize. While the name does great with the set's theme, the ability itself is pretty ridiculous. Right now, every time you harmonize, you add a ton of power to the board, and all the tokens support each other. If you harmonized 5 times in a game, you will have 25 power/toughness! I came up with this mechanic, so I am certainly to blame, but I think we need to go back to the drawing board for this before we start on the set skeleton.
Thoughts?
Harmonize: Put three +1/+1 counters on target noncreature permanent you control. It becomes a 0/0 Song creature in addition to its other types.
Here's an example:
I actually really like this new version, and it seems much more balanced and less broken. This is kind of like what the newest Nissa does, and I really like the theme of "Harmonize" bringing the plane itself to life. This would also allow us to still use the Song creature type, which I think is pretty cool. I would be happy for any feedback on this new idea!
Harmonize N. (Put N +1/+1 counters on target noncreature permanent you control. It becomes a 0/0 Song creature in addition to its other types.)
I think it opens up more design possibilities.
The text "Harmonize 3" looks a little awkward, but I think it could work! As you said, it would definitely open up more possibilities for design. I say we should use it.
Another thing I like about this is that it forces you to use an existing permanent, rather than creating one from scratch. As you mentioned, this makes a lot of sense thematically, since it simulates bringing the plane to life through music.
It also forces players to be strategic, because, yes, you could animate your lands, but at the same time, players will now be able to remove your lands much more easily (because they are creatures). Additionally, people will also be able to animate things like enchantments, artifacts, sagas, and even auras (which may or may not be a ruling nightmare... I don't know, can auras attack on their own if they're creatures?). Regardless, it will be a lot of fun. You could even do stuff like static artifacts that say "if this artifact is a creature (or "if this artifact is a Song creature"), it gets +1/+0" or stuff like that.
Overall, lots of design space, especially with Harmonize N as Shadow mentioned.
We have finally finished settling on the new and old mechanics for this set, and I can't thanks you guys enough for all the support and ideas within the past few weeks! I'm excited to get things rolling with the large scale design and common skeleton.
The next step would be to determine how many of each mechanic we want to have in each color within the common skeleton. We must remember that the two mechanics Harmonize and Rebound belong to the two main factions of the plane. The outcasts are Selesnya (G/W), and use Harmonize, while the music school is Grixis (U/B/R), and utilizes the mechanic Rebound from older mtg sets. The other two mechanics, Inspired and Enlighten, are utilized by creatures and spells respectively, however they make use of the entire color pie.
That said, here is my first attempt at a basic distribution:
Harmonize: 3 White, 2 Green
Rebound: 2 Blue, 2 Black, 3 Red
Inspired: 2 White, 1 Blue, 2 Black, 1 Red, 1 Green
Enlightened: 2 White, 1 Blue, 3 Black, 3 Red, 1 Green
When it comes to the fifth and final mechanic, Compose, this is the one that I was struggling with the most. It isn't symmetrical with any of the other four mechanics, however because it is our scry replacement, it should be in fairly high numbers:
Compose: 3 Blue, 3 Green, 1 Colorless
Another option would be to just cut compose all together, replace it with scry, and distribute more Blue and Green within the main four mechanics. What do you guys think of this idea?
I'd be happy for any feedback anyone has to offer!
Here are the new distributions:
Harmonize: 3 White, 3 Green
Rebound: 3 Blue, 2 Black, 3 Red
Inspired: 2 White, 2 Blue, 2 Black, 1 Red, 2 Green
Enlightened: 2 White, 2 Blue, 3 Black, 3 Red, 2 Green
You can see that, in taking out compose, I have added three more of the Blue and Green colors to the original four mechanics. Do you guys think this would work?
Plane/Set name: Ozorion
Name of Music School: Sazani
General Name of Outcasts: Krokr
I would be happy for any thoughts!
I've been working for the past few days on a spreadsheet for the common skeleton. You can find it here to track our official progress:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1CxEiRzdxi3FxjCbNMjzJoTLYRbuXIw7MwOI2Dh2o628/edit?usp=sharing
NOTE:
-The boxes in the skeleton with just numbers refer to creature cards with that mana cost.
-Everything below the 19 cards of each color are just mechanics and keywords we will need to include.
-I have set aside some space for each of the central mechanics next to the skeleton so we can track our progress as we go.
-This uses the skeleton, more or less, for Amonkhet, if anyone was wondering. I also constructed it around the commons skeletons of recent sets Theros Beyond Death and Ikoria for better balance.
I'll be using mtg set editor to make the final cards, but until then, anything is welcome! If anyone wants to start coming up with ideas for the commons, please do so, and I'll do the same. Let's do this!
Meant as a sort of a more flavorful version of Healer's Hawk...